I first met the author, scholar and translator Mariam Rahmani 10 years in the past in a diner in Brooklyn, N.Y., the place we have been launched by our pal, Emma. We have been each about to surrender New York for L.A., and so we chatted about our expectations and anxieties — a type of friendship blind date, a meet cute.
Just lately, I used to be speaking to Mariam at E book Soup, as a part of her guide tour, and I introduced up this diner assembly, which I’ve all the time remembered as a roseate starting to a deep and lasting friendship. “Actually, we didn’t get along at first,” she advised the viewers, to a lot laughter, and far to my shock. Then, after the occasion, strolling to the bar, Emma confirmed Mariam’s take, “No, you definitely didn’t. And it wasn’t a diner.” If I’ve a horrible reminiscence, and an obvious tendency towards folksy nostalgia, Mariam doesn’t. She is sharp, clear-eyed and all the time so modern.
Mariam brings all that fashion, wit and brilliance to “Liquid: A Love Story,” a novel that cleaves itself in two. The primary half takes place in Los Angeles, pushed by a story voice that’s at turns sardonic, hilarious and craving. The premise — marry wealthy or die making an attempt — is dealt with so intelligently and schematically (the narrator retains observe of her dates and prospects in an Excel spreadsheet), that it’s a little bit of a shock when the guide strikes to Tehran within the second half and the scheming, the wry tone, the romantic comedy of all of it, appear to slide away and our too-knowing narrator finds herself adrift, susceptible and grieving. The structural bifurcation of the novel is a daring selection, and all of the extra rewarding for its boldness. Certainly, this appears to be one of many main themes of the novel — from the keen, or willful, division of the self into thoughts and physique; to the division of safe and insecure educational labor; to overdetermined notions of East and West. Maybe essentially the most apt metaphor for a guide set in Los Angeles and Tehran is to easily say, “Liquid” is a guide troubling the fault strains.
Mariam Rahmani wears Isabel Marant jacket, Comme des Garçons males’s T-shirt, Gucci tote and classic heels.
Justin Torres: I learn this some time in the past when it was in rawer type, and now I’ve this lovely hardback. It’s a really L.A. guide, isn’t it?
Mariam Rahmani: It truly is! It’s additionally a guide through which I used to be all in favour of drawing the parallels between L.A. and Tehran. There’s meant to be a variety of continuity between the 2, just like the specificity concerning the vehicles — L.A. is a driving metropolis, clearly, however so is Tehran. There’s the stuff concerning the gentle, the truth that they’re each dry, although one is on the ocean, and one shouldn’t be close to water. In a variety of methods, I all the time noticed the guide as a love letter to L.A., but it surely’s additionally meant to faucet into the a part of L.A. that’s not fairly Tehrangeles, however this ghost of Tehran that haunts L.A., due to the entire expats.
JT: You’re from the Midwest initially. Do you know about Tehrangeles, or about what number of expats have been right here, and did you all the time wish to make it right here? Or is it simply an accident of historical past that you just ended up in Los Angeles?
MR: No, I had little interest in the West Coast. I grew up in a extremely conservative Iranian neighborhood that’s not the L.A. expats in any respect. In fact, we knew about it, it was this cultural touchstone, but it surely was additionally a type of metropolis of sin. After which, after I went to school, I left Ohio, and I went to school on the East Coast, I went to Princeton, and every little thing was primarily based on New York. I used to be a nerd, and intellectuals, quote-unquote, wish to go to New York. So, I actually solely began contemplating [L.A.] after I was researching PhD applications — I spotted {that a} scholar whose work I had used loads in the middle of my grasp’s thesis was at UCLA. After which I appeared up the remainder of the [comparative literature] program and preferred how progressive it was.
JT: We met by way of a mutual pal, proper earlier than each of us have been transferring to L.A. I used to be taking a job at UCLA as a professor, and also you have been about to start out grad faculty. I don’t assume she anticipated that both of us would significantly like L.A.
MR: It was just a little bit like, “find solace in each other.” [laughs]
JT: Which results in the subsequent query: The principle character of “Liquid” may be very clever and processes the world by way of a literary, essential gaze, whereas additionally all in favour of rom-coms [laughs]. However I’m questioning about being an mental in L.A. and discovering neighborhood, which I feel for Angelenos who dwell right here and are from right here, it’s like, “Of course.” However whenever you first transfer to this metropolis, you marvel, the place are all of the guide nerds?
MR: I feel that that’s undoubtedly true by way of the lived neighborhood within the metropolis. It takes some time to determine it out. Given the truth that I used to be hooked up to UCLA, I wasn’t starved for dialog. I feel one factor that the guide is all in favour of is what number of L.A.s exist inside Los Angeles, and the truth that it means such various things to completely different individuals, and it means various things in basic methods — how they relate to their our bodies, what they put on, whether or not they wax. You additionally see [the narrator] persevering with to discover town and going locations she wouldn’t have had entry to, if not for attaching herself to certainly one of these dates.
JT: Sure, the guide is hilarious about courting. She’s making an attempt to go on 100 dates with the intention to discover a wealthy particular person to marry. The tone of the primary half of the guide, which is about in L.A., may be very wry. I feel you characterize town in an interesting method, and I don’t assume you’re denigrating in any respect, however the place she is in her life — she’s an adjunct professor, making an attempt to make ends meet, scraping issues collectively — she feels very dissatisfied, very a lot looking out. Discuss just a little bit about courting and elegance in L.A.
Mariam, holding an Hermès scarf within the aisles of Jons Market.
MR: She has a variety of enjoyable with fashion in L.A. She finds it very liberating. She typically gives the tags of what she’s carrying, it’s virtually like a trend article or one thing. There are designer names floating all through the guide — that’s tied up in her dissatisfaction, as a result of she has to do a variety of thrift retailer looking and consignment looking to have the ability to purchase the items that she buys.
JT: Which may be very eco-friendly!
MR: Yeah, yeah, that’s true. [laughs] There’s an curiosity in how huge town is, geographically and in inhabitants, but in addition by way of the emotional panorama of L.A. There’s a playfulness there that wouldn’t exist, for instance, should you have been writing a guide set in New York. The texture of town is chaotic, and every little thing goes. And there’s a variety of shade, proper? Blue skies, and he or she talks concerning the palm bushes and the flowers.
There’s additionally a threatening side to that sunniness that I feel you’re getting at — the alternative of the trope of darkness representing problem. Oftentimes the brightest moments, the brightest gentle, is what signifies her dissatisfaction. That does converse to the expertise of town. Once you transfer to L.A. as a transplant, you will have a completely completely different relationship to the solar than you ever did earlier than. You’re spending insane quantities of cash on sunscreen, and also you’re shopping for all these hats — you used to make enjoyable of people that put on hats.
JT: Did I? Effectively, jokes on me. I’m quickly turning right into a leather-based bag. I’ve resigned myself to it. However yeah, on the East Coast, it’s the seasons. My emotional and psychological state was so deeply tied to the seasons. I’m used to falling again in love with the world in spring and going wild in summer season, after which getting severe within the fall, getting extremely depressed within the winter. That was simply the routine of my life. And L.A., it’s such a shock, as a result of whenever you transfer right here and when it’s time to be depressed for 3 months, it’s nonetheless blindingly vibrant out.
MR: There are seasons, however they’re so small, and the wavelengths are a lot smaller, the change is way smaller, and that actually mimics her expertise and the PhD. As a result of issues are altering barely, she is progressing in this system, and you find yourself assembly her after she’s performed, and he or she’s simply reminiscing on that, and her life nonetheless hasn’t actually modified. That type of motion by way of time with out the satisfaction of a giant change, whether or not it’s a downturn to winter or an upturn to spring, is vital too.
JT: Within the second half of the guide, she strikes to Tehran. You have been speaking concerning the similarities between the 2 cities and but the guide feels fully completely different when she arrives.
MR: Sure, as a result of her place is completely different. She’s an outsider, proper? Once you catch her in her L.A. second, she’s been there for a very long time, and he or she’s making an attempt to remain. Her dissatisfaction is with the truth that it’s not understanding — her job isn’t adequate to justify that. The rationale I needed her to maneuver to Tehran, partially, was as a result of she is such a sensible ass. She all the time has a learn on every little thing. After which that will get fully destabilized. Once more, to make use of a metaphor that applies to each cities, it’s like there’s an earthquake between that separates the 2 halves. The bottom falls out from underneath her ft. She doesn’t know her method round.
Mariam wears a Marni costume.
There’s additionally a type of joke concerning the type of blind insistence that it takes to be a scholar, to maintain doing what you’re doing, even when the world is falling aside, and even if you end up falling aside emotionally. You see that within the guide too, as a result of she really finds a technique to proceed her undertaking.
JT: I wish to pivot just a little bit to speak about academia. Your important character is a hyper-educated, hyper-intelligent humanist, trapped in poorly remunerated, precarious, adjunct labor. I feel there’s a legitimate critique of the academy inherent within the novel. Although you wrote this earlier than the tradition shifted — do issues really feel completely different at this specific political second, when universities are being attacked from the correct?
MR: I feel there’s a extra primary level too, which is that the guide wasn’t written for this world. It’s all set in the summertime of 2019 as a decent timeline of three months, and its criticisms are usually not of the present rule. In some methods, it’s small potatoes in comparison with what’s occurring now. Sadly, books take so lengthy to come back out that even should you write them fairly shortly, they’re all the time going to be dated. And by way of the priority with academia, it’s not even actually a criticism of academia itself a lot because the decadence of the type of capitalism we’re residing in proper now, which doesn’t assist the humanities, has no use for summary pondering. It was that academia was the equal of a convent, the place the nuns and monks went to do their pondering, and even that doesn’t exist anymore. The criticism is de facto on the broader tradition than the politics of the convent, however definitely she additionally has these petty issues of her personal life, and he or she desires to earn more money and he or she desires to purchase nicer garments and go to nicer eating places.
JT: Yeah, for a very long time, it was regarded as a vocation, and the promise of that has all however evaporated. In the meantime, right here’s this character in L.A. and every little thing’s flashy and glossy and attractive, and he or she’s younger, and he or she desires to be flashy and glossy and attractive too, and he or she is. It’s a very attractive guide. What have been you interested by when writing intercourse?
MR: Earlier than I wrote the guide, my rule about intercourse scenes was, don’t write them. They all the time fail. Should you’re making an attempt to make it scorching, it sounds silly. Should you’re making an attempt to level out some bizarre side of intercourse, it simply turns into gross or grotesque. However this guide is de facto within the building of femininity, prefer it’s not a pure factor. I simply needed to do it to ensure that the guide to really be speaking about what it claimed to be speaking about. The guide can be invested in courting norms and gendered norms, and he or she dates men and women. There’s a joke about how she finally ends up courting so many extra males exactly as a result of wealth distribution shouldn’t be equal among the many genders within the US.
JT: This very rom-com idea you’ve give you — happening 100 dates with the intention to marry wealthy. It collapses intercourse and energy. Makes all of it very clear and transactional. She rejects the fantasy that intercourse is simply about intimacy and connection, and never about these different kinds of transactions. When intimacy pops up, it’s really fairly shocking within the novel and virtually extra genuine, as a result of she should actually be feeling one thing.
However tonally, it’s a cynical technique to start the novel, proper? And it strikes to a very completely different place ultimately, but it surely begins in a cynical place. It’s fascinating, as a result of I consider L.A. as one of many least cynical locations I’ve ever lived. That is clearly a gross generality, but it surely actually feels true to me that folks right here are likely to take a extra optimistic tone. I’m questioning concerning the expertise of getting such a cynical character in such, once more, a cheery, sunny spot.
MR: Effectively, I feel that the cheeriness, the friendliness, they’re type of garments, proper? Like it’s masking one thing. And all garments are usually not lies, generally individuals really feel that their garments really categorical themselves, however there’s all the time that distance between the physique and what you’re presenting to different individuals.
Justin Torres is the creator of “We the Animals” and “Blackouts,” which received the Nationwide E book Award.
